The Green Room podcast
Are pioneers better at learning or unlearning?
Old habits die hard. But can the ideas that made us successful start to hold us back?
Knowledge is power
But progress depends on knowing when to question it.
We learn, gain experience and, over time, begin to trust our judgement. But the world doesn't stand still – what worked for us before won’t always work again. And the longer an idea lasts, the harder it can be to let it go.
Pioneers aren’t just those who think differently once; they’re people who continually challenge their own thinking.
Jasmine Robinson and Alice John use their experience driving change in the sports industry to help us explore our big question. Is our biggest barrier to progress what we don’t know, or what we think we already know? When does experience sharpen our thinking, and when can it prevent us from seeing new possibilities? And do we need to rethink everything, or are some principles worth holding onto?
Watch below, or listen on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, YouTube or wherever you get your podcasts. Read the transcript here.
"What pioneers do, what visionaries do, is ask: what if there’s a different way? What’s the cut-through? How can we do something differently?"
Alice John – growth and development advisory, Deloitte's Sports Business Group
"Does anyone actually want to watch women’s basketball?"
As co-founder of Monarch Collective, a fund investing in women's sport teams, leagues and rights, Jasmine Robinson was helping to build belief in a market many still viewed through the lens of men's sport. For her, the shift wasn’t just about getting people to learn something new. It also required challenging assumptions that had shaped the industry for years.
Jasmine believes women’s sport should be recognised as an exciting product in its own right, rather than viewed primarily as a social cause – a shift she describes as a "joyful activation".
But challenging assumptions means being willing to make bets that others aren’t. For Jasmine, innovation depends on taking calculated risks and creating a culture where people feel safe to test, learn and, when necessary, change course. And so, at Monarch, risk-taking is built into its core.
It's this willingness and the vision to question conventional wisdom, coupled with the confidence to act on a different view, that has helped Monarch move early on investments in women’s sport that many initially saw as too risky.
Read more about how women’s sports are rapidly rising as a unique powerhouse: Game changers: Unlocking the potential of women’s sports
"Is this mission-critical?"
Learning and unlearning are often seen as opposites. But in practice, both require judgement. After all, not every tradition is outdated, and not every new idea is better.
For Alice John, who works in growth and development advisory in Deloitte’s Sports Business Group, knowing what ideas to let go of starts with knowing where you're trying to go. This requires a mixture of perspectives: future-gazing to imagine what comes next, alongside the architects and planners who understand something inside out.
But deciding exactly when to unlearn is rarely straightforward. Along the way, lots of little things might go wrong, and you have to decide whether they're genuine setbacks or simply part of ironing out the creases along the way. For Alice, it comes down to identifying what is "mission-critical" and "letting go of the small stuff".
But on the flip side, Jasmine reminds us that if things are going well, that doesn’t mean you can’t still course correct. As she explains, “don’t mistake good for what could be great.” She advises us to always be on the lookout for what other trends you can push on and where you can build on the momentum you’ve already gained.
You can read more about Alice’s work on Birmingham Sports Quarter - Sport is sparking Birmingham’s next chapter
Back to the drawing board?
Experience helps us recognise patterns, but it can't guarantee what will work in the future. And yet, abandoning everything we know would leave us starting from scratch. Instead, unlearning and learning are part of the same cycle, where we don’t throw away hard-earned knowledge, but build on it in new ways.
Hear more from Jasmine Robinson and Alice John as they explore how to navigate the line between trusting experience and challenging it. They explore how to stay fresh and innovative without losing vision, the importance of building a culture where everyone owns mistakes and takes smart risks, and why the right time to change tack isn’t only when things go wrong.
Watch below, or listen on Apple Podcasts, Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts. Read the transcript here.
"If there’s not that culture of support, owning your mistakes, learning from it and moving on, I think it’s really hard to get to innovation."
Jasmine Robinson – co-founder and managing partner, Monarch Collective
Let’s make this work.
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What does it take to turn ideas into impact?
The future isn’t built by accident. Explore more insights from Series 15, where we learn from the people brave enough to think big, and explore the role we can all play in turning bold ideas into progress.
