WEBVTT X-TIMESTAMP-MAP=LOCAL:00:00:00.000,MPEGTS:0 00:03.440 --> 00:08.040 Hello, and welcome to this series of conversations on the future of cities. 00:08.820 --> 00:10.299 Joining us today is Mrs. 00:10.740 --> 00:17.420 Maimunah Mohd Sharif, which is the executive director of the United Nations h- Human 00:17.560 --> 00:19.920 Settlements Program, or UN-Habitat. 00:20.400 --> 00:25.060 It's my pleasure to have you here and to welcome you to this conversation. 00:27.140 --> 00:32.920 The pandemic has, brought in numerous additional challenges to cities. 00:33.840 --> 00:40.500 The UN-Habitat and the United Nations Human Settlements Program have been working on the 00:40.540 --> 00:46.720 response to COVID, focusing on urban centers across the globe, 00:47.540 --> 00:50.720 with a particular emphasis in Asia and in Africa. 00:50.900 --> 00:52.820 Thank you very much, Mr. Miguel. 00:53.220 --> 00:59.080 thank you for having me, in this, a session interview with delight, and I'm, I'm very 00:59.100 --> 01:01.860 happy to be here. What is the impact that you see in urban 01:01.900 --> 01:07.700 ecosystems, and how do you see these urban ecosystems or these cities changing in the 01:07.740 --> 01:09.480 light, in the light of COVID? 01:10.280 --> 01:17.140 COVID-19 pandemic is a wake-up call for all of us and, and to see how we can better up our 01:17.300 --> 01:19.920 sustainable development and also cities design. 01:20.000 --> 01:26.040 So normally with disruption come opportunities, and we have seen cities 01:26.660 --> 01:33.060 seizing the opportunity, not only tackling the pandemic and, its consequences, but also 01:33.260 --> 01:37.200 reconsider with all those who live in cities. 01:37.660 --> 01:43.060 Actually, we used to hear how to build back better, greener, more 01:43.200 --> 01:44.880 just and more inclusive. 01:44.940 --> 01:51.530 And our challenge, as UN-Habitat is to build on these opportunities together with 01:51.640 --> 01:55.130 all the stakeholders for a sustainable urban future. 01:55.420 --> 02:01.440 So because we know that is, historically cities and government have taken steps to 02:01.500 --> 02:07.480 address the health crisis and, and also very critical, not only to build back better, but 02:07.540 --> 02:10.720 also to prevent the future, future crisis. 02:10.820 --> 02:12.280 This is very, very important. 02:12.320 --> 02:19.160 By 2050, the world population will be, around 70%, or to be exact, 66% will 02:19.240 --> 02:24.380 be, reside in, in cities, and you know that the COVID-19, cities is the epicenter. 02:24.680 --> 02:31.040 We need to concentrate our effort now to build back better through design, through planning, 02:31.600 --> 02:33.080 and also through investment. 02:33.200 --> 02:38.560 To us, Miguel, that is, this is the opportunity to look back into our urban 02:38.600 --> 02:45.500 development, our city design to rethink how can we put, the, the, the new 02:45.640 --> 02:51.220 model of integrated planning and, and, and to link between smaller cities, 02:51.400 --> 02:53.240 rural district, metropolitan. 02:53.320 --> 02:56.220 So I would like to bring two points, Miguel. 02:56.880 --> 03:03.180 One is on density, and the other one is on the well-planned cities and more integrated matter. 03:04.060 --> 03:10.420 What would you say, are the three main trends shaping the future of cities? 03:10.500 --> 03:16.640 There is no, one size fit for all in term of the, of the, work of the future cities. 03:16.980 --> 03:23.840 But to me, the, the, the next, the future cities need to be to concentrate on the 03:23.960 --> 03:25.260 inclusive recovery. 03:25.560 --> 03:28.940 So this is very, very important for us to look at the health. 03:29.500 --> 03:33.120 I think health infrastructure, housing, and income. 03:33.260 --> 03:34.560 I think it's very, very important. 03:34.600 --> 03:39.400 I think now it's not so much in term of the accessibility of health. 03:39.860 --> 03:43.880 To me, it's the proximity of health and also housing. 03:44.340 --> 03:49.910 We lock down, ask people to, to, to stay in the house and to sh- to, to, to, to, 03:50.920 --> 03:52.900 to experience this, social distancing. 03:53.400 --> 03:54.960 How about the people who have no house? 03:55.280 --> 03:57.140 Those people who are most vulnerable. 03:57.200 --> 03:59.200 So I think this is also very important for all. 03:59.720 --> 04:04.120 Healthcare for all, housing for all, and at the same time, it's in term 04:04.200 --> 04:06.040 of the economic activities. 04:06.200 --> 04:09.720 This is very, very important for us in term of the investment. 04:10.140 --> 04:16.500 How can we look into expanding the opportunities that during the pandemic now, 04:17.620 --> 04:24.340 the government have taken action on, reducing the rental, providing the 04:24.409 --> 04:30.940 basic services, re- trying to reduce the displacement of, people, and trying to provide 04:31.000 --> 04:33.320 housing, trying to provide basic services. 04:33.520 --> 04:37.180 We need to, to strengthen and move forward with all this. 04:37.420 --> 04:43.140 And also under social protection, because the d- now is a digital, element. 04:43.200 --> 04:49.780 But half of the, of the, of the, of the, cities, of, of the population are offline. 04:50.440 --> 04:55.660 So now we need to look into the connectivity, communication, I think in the future. 04:56.160 --> 05:03.040 And also how we can see that cities is like a, cities is a social good and at the 05:03.120 --> 05:04.670 same time the public good. 05:04.860 --> 05:07.600 So last but not least is integrated planning. 05:07.660 --> 05:13.180 I've been a planner. basically I would like to see how we integrate 05:13.190 --> 05:17.940 to look into the integrated approach of planning, integrated approach of, 05:19.580 --> 05:23.740 po- policymaking, and also integrated approach of implementation. 05:24.120 --> 05:28.340 Talking about the mixed users, compact, compact cities. 05:28.580 --> 05:30.610 We cannot plan just for our own country. Yeah. 05:30.620 --> 05:33.080 But we have to look into the metropolitan original. 05:33.400 --> 05:38.500 So I think this is the, the, the, the element, the new business model that we will, we would 05:38.560 --> 05:42.640 like to see in the, in the recovery period and the future cities. 05:43.000 --> 05:49.820 As we know, of course, UN-Habitat's strategy 20- 2020-2023 has a strong 05:49.940 --> 05:52.100 focus on, social inclusion. 05:52.720 --> 05:57.580 Mm-hmm. what do you think are the path and, and, and 05:57.700 --> 06:01.250 critical success factors to plan inclusive cities? 06:01.340 --> 06:07.056 So when we talk about cities, we are planning for the people.We don't plan cities for cars, 06:07.416 --> 06:09.125 we don't plan cities for anything else. 06:09.176 --> 06:10.516 We are plan cities for people. 06:10.716 --> 06:16.376 So it's more reason when we do the planning, we should be as inclusive as possible. 06:17.136 --> 06:23.476 this include, I, I believe in, we need to move from community 06:24.316 --> 06:26.896 participation to community engagement. 06:27.096 --> 06:31.396 When you engage the people, there is a feedback s- loop. 06:31.416 --> 06:33.776 That you engage, they give the feedback, then they go back to them. 06:33.816 --> 06:37.276 In UN-Habitat we have, people process. 06:37.856 --> 06:43.756 People process, in, in planning, where we include not only in term of planning, but also 06:43.816 --> 06:46.156 in term of budgeting. We have the gender responsive 06:46.536 --> 06:48.136 participatory, budgeting. 06:48.556 --> 06:54.516 So I think this is, is very, very important for us to look into the, the e-element of 06:54.676 --> 06:59.396 participation, element of inclusivity, because our mantra is leaving no one behind. 06:59.556 --> 07:03.076 How do we implement that mantra, leaving no one behind? 07:03.356 --> 07:06.416 Who is going to take, to, to use these public spaces? 07:06.446 --> 07:08.456 So I think we need to get their feedback. 07:09.636 --> 07:14.536 And I was a mayor in Penang for, for, for eight years and, and, we went to the ground to 07:14.716 --> 07:20.176 talk to the people because sometime that we cannot draw the plan on the air, on the 16th 07:20.216 --> 07:23.096 floor of the building without going our foot on the ground. 07:23.156 --> 07:28.496 So I think by getting the information from them, we can reduce in term of the, cost of 07:28.556 --> 07:34.196 maintenance, cost of, building, and also more useful, and it create better impact. 07:34.476 --> 07:37.536 When you talk about housing, it must include social inclusion. 07:37.996 --> 07:39.776 Transportation, social inclusion. 07:39.816 --> 07:44.576 We talk ab-about education and also about employment, this is must be cross-cutting. 07:44.656 --> 07:49.256 It cannot be seg-segmented or, or categorized as one sector. 07:49.576 --> 07:56.136 Let's go to planning, which, which, which I've seen it's, a topic you are very connected to. 07:57.416 --> 08:03.336 I would say the one trend that we have identified is, which is kind of m- much, much 08:03.456 --> 08:08.386 more emphasis now, is everything around making sure that we plan on a, on a greener way, 08:08.456 --> 08:09.656 let's call it like that. 08:10.156 --> 08:14.405 that we make urban planning on a sustainable way, taking into account the better 08:14.455 --> 08:16.936 utilization of the, of the, of the urban space. 08:17.676 --> 08:21.516 How do you see the, the cities in Africa and Asia following this approach? 08:21.796 --> 08:26.656 when you talk about the, the, planning, in term of the future of cities and planning, 08:27.036 --> 08:31.896 looking into the urban, sustainability, this is very, very important in term of, urban, 08:32.316 --> 08:38.476 su-susceptibility, and see how the, the city, au-authorities link to the, to the, 08:39.516 --> 08:45.436 sustainable management of urban resources, and then link to the efficient urban mobility and, 08:45.596 --> 08:47.196 and, green urban form. 08:47.536 --> 08:53.396 So when you look into the, areas, within the, the, the, 08:54.356 --> 08:59.716 Asia and also in Africa, our footprint, our, UN-Habitat, 09:00.936 --> 09:07.836 HQ is in, in Kenya, is, is in the continent of Africa, is for more effort, we put 09:07.916 --> 09:12.556 out to, to work together with the government of Kenya and also the government of, of, of 09:12.656 --> 09:15.796 the other cities and the countries in, in Africa. 09:15.836 --> 09:22.416 And what we know is that the rate of urbanization will be the highest in 09:22.476 --> 09:24.516 Africa and in Asia. 09:24.896 --> 09:31.036 So this is, very, very important for us to really need to have a control 09:31.136 --> 09:32.576 and plan urbanization. 09:33.036 --> 09:36.736 Control and also plan, extension of a city. 09:36.876 --> 09:43.576 we have a program in, public spaces in Dandora, in, in, in Little, in, in, in, in, in, 09:43.796 --> 09:45.226 Nairobi, town itself. 09:45.756 --> 09:50.136 And also in Asia, with Surabaya, I think is, is, is very, very good example. 09:50.556 --> 09:52.676 And, in term of solid waste, management. 09:53.076 --> 09:54.616 And at the same time in Malaysia. 09:54.996 --> 10:00.836 So now UN-Habitat is working also together with, UN, Food and Agriculture Organization, 10:01.796 --> 10:04.396 to, to have a African forum on urban forests. 10:04.476 --> 10:05.636 This is also important. 10:05.916 --> 10:10.816 So to me is that we are working together with the, wi-with the government in African 10:10.876 --> 10:17.516 continent, in Asia, because we also have our, our, our regional office, and we are trying 10:17.896 --> 10:24.676 to, to, to, to understand and also giving our, our advice, our technical, expertise. 10:24.736 --> 10:31.036 So yesterday I was in a workshop, with a, with a s- a city ecosystem, where there were many 10:31.076 --> 10:35.776 of the players of the city exactly discussing the 2030 strategy for the city, and they all 10:35.856 --> 10:37.756 contributed and, and so on, and s- and so on. 10:38.096 --> 10:43.566 How do you see this happening, across the regions that you are more, that you are more 10:43.676 --> 10:47.296 connected to, and what do you see as an obstacle to that? 10:47.776 --> 10:51.656 Yeah. to me, Michael, that I believe in the 10:51.716 --> 10:52.936 principle of four P. 10:53.976 --> 10:56.676 Public, private, people, partnership. 10:57.496 --> 11:00.616 If you don't use one P, lacking, then you cannot move forward. 11:00.776 --> 11:01.856 I believe in four P. 11:02.036 --> 11:05.976 Public is the government or the UN entities are public. 11:06.096 --> 11:10.376 Private is the private sector, the banking, the World Bank and all those, and then people. 11:10.936 --> 11:11.956 So then it's partnership. 11:12.236 --> 11:18.336 Apart from these four Ps, top-down to a certain extent, bottom-up, you know, bottom-up. 11:18.536 --> 11:23.196 Of course, we need, visionary leaders to have the vision, so they have a top-down, and we 11:23.256 --> 11:26.956 have the bottom-up, and conversion of ideas at the center. 11:27.076 --> 11:28.616 Different countries have different challenges. 11:28.916 --> 11:34.756 Whether they have the governance to move forward, the ready governance, the enabling 11:34.796 --> 11:41.536 environment, for the, laws and regulation, and also for the policies for, for the 11:41.576 --> 11:44.696 recovery to move forward, in term of future cities. 11:45.196 --> 11:48.796 And then whether the, the, the another obstacle maybe is top of the technology. 11:49.976 --> 11:51.356 Technology and creativity. 11:51.476 --> 11:56.436 Whether they have the technology, whether they have the data in order to help for, for this 11:56.456 --> 11:57.956 policy formulation. 11:58.026 --> 12:03.756 Whether they have the political will to really move forward, to change the things that the, 12:03.916 --> 12:09.264 the already, the, the blockage that we n- for each country to move forward.And, the, and, 12:09.304 --> 12:12.514 and also on top of the, another is the capacity. 12:13.104 --> 12:18.004 Whether the country have the, the capacity, the knowledge, the, the, the in term of the 12:18.104 --> 12:21.544 human, human, development, the talent to move forward. 12:21.984 --> 12:26.664 And last but not least, I, I always believe in integrated approach, not fragmented. 12:26.904 --> 12:31.624 So I think this is, all this is already embedded in the New Urban Agenda. 12:31.864 --> 12:33.784 We have only 10 more years to go. 12:33.844 --> 12:37.504 So whatever it is, the moment should start now. 12:37.794 --> 12:42.544 What do you what, what do you think are, are the role of governments on driving change at 12:42.584 --> 12:46.004 the local level? Because sometimes we see m- we see, I would 12:46.084 --> 12:52.544 say, l- local municipalities doing, I would say, very relevant efforts, but not all the 12:52.624 --> 12:55.144 times there's, there's a, a national alignment. 12:55.804 --> 13:01.614 W- what, what, how do you see the relevance of national alignments and, and, and the national 13:01.684 --> 13:04.654 strategies aligning with the s- with the city strategies? 13:05.364 --> 13:09.104 Yeah. UN-Habitat, when we did the strategic plan, 13:09.484 --> 13:16.274 Miguel, on the 2020 to 20, '23, we looked into the four domain of, 13:16.364 --> 13:21.664 of change from poverty to s- to, cities prosperity, to climate 13:21.764 --> 13:23.884 change, and to urban crisis. 13:23.984 --> 13:29.484 And we, we put up 12, outcomes, for the, for our strategic plan 13:29.504 --> 13:31.444 from, 2020 to 2023. 13:31.904 --> 13:38.704 So this is at, at UN-Habitat level, and we need the national government, and also to work 13:38.764 --> 13:45.684 together with also other UN agencies and other stakeholders, to put these elements into 13:45.744 --> 13:49.564 their, their, their, national, policy. 13:49.644 --> 13:56.384 I believe in that whatever the policies in the, national urban policy and, and the 13:56.444 --> 14:00.764 strategy there, who else, who else can you implement it? 14:00.824 --> 14:03.004 You cannot implement the policy on air. 14:03.484 --> 14:05.824 You have to co- implement it on the ground. 14:06.124 --> 14:08.464 But who are pe- who are on the ground? 14:08.524 --> 14:11.564 It's the mayor, it's the cities, it's the people are on the ground. 14:11.884 --> 14:18.774 And, and now, UN-Habitat's, has, has, managed to get around 150 countries who 14:18.844 --> 14:20.564 already have the national urban policy. 14:20.584 --> 14:26.334 This national urban policy process can bring down together all sectors of policies and 14:26.504 --> 14:32.344 actors in the urban, impact, towards the, the depend on each country. 14:32.404 --> 14:38.384 But so to this is very, very important that the national government should, should engage 14:38.944 --> 14:44.624 the, local, government when, where they, when formulating the national urban policy. 14:44.704 --> 14:47.444 I think this is, the, the, the, the, the connection. 14:48.064 --> 14:54.494 And, of course, the national government also play a very crucial role, in supporting cities, 14:54.924 --> 14:59.184 not only in term of policy, and also the governance, the, the rules and the procedure, 14:59.264 --> 15:00.944 the investment, the finance. 15:01.404 --> 15:06.204 Because we need to, to, to link to, to the local government in order to see the 15:06.264 --> 15:10.744 implementation of the New Urban Agenda, and also the, the, the achieving the SDG, 15:11.244 --> 15:12.724 especially the SDG 11. 15:12.944 --> 15:17.684 How do you think What, what would you recommend, or w- w- what's your call for 15:17.724 --> 15:24.644 action for us to accelerate the, it's, i- i- achieving the, the objectives of, of SDG 11 15:24.804 --> 15:29.244 an- and others? W- what can we expect to achieve in 2030? 15:29.924 --> 15:35.564 So the SDG 11, if you look into the, total of the 17 SDG, 15:36.204 --> 15:41.724 64% of the policies if in the 17 SDG to be implemented in cities. 15:41.764 --> 15:44.224 So this is very, very important, the role of cities. 15:44.604 --> 15:51.404 So to me is that, the real potential for the, for the member state and all stakeholders 15:51.484 --> 15:56.244 is, to tap, the politi- the, to tap into the political will. 15:56.304 --> 16:01.854 And this is very, very important for us to look into the significant, green investment, 16:02.384 --> 16:07.364 for the, for the infrastructure and also economic, response, to bring structural, 16:08.044 --> 16:11.604 changes, to achieve the, sustainable, development. 16:11.704 --> 16:15.124 So we need to commit a longer-term, action. 16:15.624 --> 16:20.604 We need to harness the transformative potential of the pandemic response. 16:21.064 --> 16:26.804 We'll need robust policy, and also we'll need sustained, action and also the investment. 16:27.024 --> 16:33.964 So to me, the, the, the, the way that we move forward is now, and there 16:33.984 --> 16:38.344 is no other, other, people need to say there is no other planet B. 16:38.444 --> 16:44.054 We have to be together to move forward and, and, and, and get the, this green recovery, 16:44.284 --> 16:50.504 build back better and safer and greener, happen and be a reality for our future, 16:50.804 --> 16:53.124 for today's, and also our future generations. 16:53.624 --> 16:57.584 Before I pose you one last question, is there, is there anything you would like to comment or 16:57.624 --> 16:59.744 to add to this conversation? 17:00.424 --> 17:03.653 Yeah. Miguel, when you talk, when we talk about the, 17:04.764 --> 17:11.484 future, cities, I think this is very important for us to identify 17:11.564 --> 17:13.344 whose future are we talking about now. 17:14.884 --> 17:16.644 Future cities, future for whom? 17:17.244 --> 17:20.864 Is it That's why the come in, the inclusivity have to come in just now. 17:21.104 --> 17:27.804 When you talk about future city, leaving no one behind, inclusivity, and also don't 17:27.864 --> 17:33.264 forget about the, people, or disable, with disability, the womens, 17:33.724 --> 17:34.924 and also the children. 17:35.204 --> 17:40.664 I think this is very important for us to The, the, the, the, the criteria and the entity of 17:40.864 --> 17:44.774 what, what, what at the end of the day comes as the future city. 17:44.824 --> 17:50.544 And I would like to see sustainable urbanization, and at the same time, real, real 17:50.664 --> 17:56.974 sustainable and real, real development that is well-planned and for the people in the future. 17:57.204 --> 18:02.444 Can you- Yeah can you describe me, or describe us, to the ones that will listen to you, the 18:02.504 --> 18:05.174 city you would like to live 10 years from now. 18:05.644 --> 18:06.664 How would it look like? 18:07.464 --> 18:09.444 As, as I told you, I'm an urban planner. 18:09.804 --> 18:14.644 I think first thing when I was in college, my lecturer told me about neighborhood planning. 18:15.564 --> 18:18.084 You know, neighborhood planning. I think this is linked with the Paris 18:18.104 --> 18:19.544 15-minute city. Yeah. 18:19.624 --> 18:24.284 So b- to me, in 10 years' time, I would like to live in a city which is 18:24.344 --> 18:26.044 self-sustained and green. 18:26.644 --> 18:27.804 Yeah. Mrs. 18:27.964 --> 18:29.804 Maimunah- Thank you thank you very much. 18:30.124 --> 18:32.284 It was a privilege for me to talk to you. 18:33.364 --> 18:35.394 I would like to, to thank you for this interview. 18:35.474 --> 18:39.684 It's great to see that, you personally, and of course United Nations, are making a huge 18:39.724 --> 18:45.504 impact, for, for us, for our kids, and for, for future generations, and thank you very 18:45.584 --> 18:49.604 much for your time. And I also would like to say thank you on 18:49.664 --> 18:55.944 behalf of, executive director UN-Habitat and all my team, for having UN-Habitat in your 18:56.024 --> 18:59.944 program, and also highlighting our, our, work. 19:00.224 --> 19:06.904 And I would like to, to work with you and also with the other, s- partners so that we can 19:06.944 --> 19:08.744 create a better future for all. 19:09.004 --> 19:10.344 Thank you very much. Thank you very much.